September 2011.

Both Bobby V AND Tito Franconca were not where the fault lies, the first is now being made a pariah by the players after the latter was ripped by management.

I would more likely say the team suffers from a self-image problem, mostly brought on my bloated management, self-indulgent players and fans who never know how to say "no." 

It is more a sense of entitlement and arrogance, that they can do no wrong, and exacerbated by ownership whose "God" is the bottom line. Witness the totally hyped sellout streak which everyone knew was a fraud.

If you want to succeed you have to strip away all the garbage that was preventing you. I honestly don't think that was the on-the-field manager's fault. The problem runs much much much deeper than that.

Spoiled prima donnas.  Oooo, Bobby made me hit .238; oooo, Bobby made me walk 8 guys in 4 innings; oooo, Bobby left me in to pitch and bruised my fragile little ego.  Let's grow up, Sox, and own up to the fact that you collectively stunk last year.  As Bill Parcells might tell you, you were what your record said you were: pretty awful, bottom of the league, el stinko.

So man up, and stop whining about what was and blaming someone else who was NOT holding your bat, nor fielding your position, nor throwing your pitches.  You get paid, in many cases, exorbitant amounts of money for working from March to October, far too much for far too little work, to be blaming your poor performance on someone else.

Just be like Pedroia and own up, move on, and start enjoying the game.  And as for Big Papi, you crybaby PED user, I loved your comment last week that you will get upset if people ask you about some of your colleagues on the new list of PED users from Miami.  You signed on for this job, you got caught cheating (though never punished, except for the physicial punishment one gets from using then stopping steroids, like torn Achilles tendons), and now you act belligerent that someone might ask you a ligitimate question about PED use in the game.  Please try to grow up and act like an adult.  Those of us not infatuated with everything Red Sox-ian think you are a lame brain and a knucklehead.

I like David Ortiz as a player, but he has proven over and over that his ego is what controls his big yap. He just can't help himself. He knows it all and he'll tell you about it. What a bunch of whiny, overpaid, egotistical jerks. What other job, with the exception of politics can one go into, get paid huge sums of money, not do your job, stink out the place. Not get shipped out with the brats and ner-do-wells that went to LA where they are now underachieving as well (that must be Bobby V's fault too), and then come out and complain about the boss from last year who's already been shown the door? This kind of crap does not bode well for the season. Farrell should stop these idiots from talking to the media at all. Just play ball and shut up.

How many times did Bobby strike out last season?

What did we learn from this article? Was there one ounce of new material? A complete mail in from Shank. 

I figured there would be at least one poster who blamed the messenger, DS - jakefenn did it.  I seldom read three paragraph posts but amirllr  was right on.  I'm glad DS wrote this column because he put into words what I've been thinking everytime I read one of the players' Bobby V comments.  Granted, Bobby Valentine was not a good manager for this particular bunch of overpaid, pampered whiners (maybe he could succeed with a different group), but how do the whiners explain their performance in September, 2011?  They supposedly adored Tito Francona and they played horribly.  I had a glimmer of hope for this year's group but it's gone - and I for one think David Ortiz is an overrated crybaby.  Go Celtics! 

Why do you even ask Ortiz the question ? It's always the fault of someone else..never his personal responsibility

My biggest problem with this article was the fact that Middlebrooks got his two cents in. I'm sorry, but a kid from Texas with one year experience playing in Boston has no freakin' clue as to what it takes 'to understand this city.' 

What does this article tell me? That the Sox are weak mentally. They should say 'Bobby who' when asked about him. New year, they need to focus on winning THIS YEAR not how sorry they still feel about how bad they sucked last year. 

The press prods and prods these players to make comments about Valentine.  So they do.  Then they are vilified by that same press.  Sometimes you just can't win.  And how do we go from a few players making some minor critisism's to "everything is Valentine's fault"?

Another BS column from you Dan. Pedroia was interviewed on the radio last week and specifically said it was the players who didn't perform last year. He actually said he did not want to blame Valentine. It's a new season, Valentine is gone, about 50 percent of the team has changed and yet you still want to drum up resentment of this year's team. Why is that?

Seems like the RS players could take another clue from the Patriots: don't say anything unless it is a positive team-oriented statement that focuses on the game and the goals for the season. You are not going to change a single thing that happened in the past, so stop feeding the controversy and turn the page. Seems like Pedroia understands this - so take a clue from him if you don't like the Patriots analogy.

Dan - Get a grip.  The meteor was not Vanlentine's fault.  It was George Bush's fault.

What's hard to understand about this behavior is the fact that most of us have had a boss you didn't like or respect. That didn't mean you got a pass on your work. You were getting paid so you did your job. It's what a professional is expected to do.

I understand professional sports are different than real life but somebody has to tell these guys to take a long look at themselves and stop blaming everbody/everything else. It's tough to be a winning team when you have a loser's mentality.

Last season was Valentine's fault and yours Dan. Please leave Boston, you stink.

What a classless bunch of pukes these Red Sox players are.  Blame it ALL on Valentine.  Why not just blame it on Bush?  I do believe that Ortiz went into the tank when it became obvious that the Sox were not going to get into the playoffs.  He is a 43 year old player going on 38 who is just protecting his contract.

Dan Shaughnessy fanning the flames to create a bigger controversy? Seems like I've seen that before-- a pattern. Really a distorted article-- three examples at the beginning: one is manufactured (the Aceves comment); one might be valid. And the gratuitous reference to the traffic on the interstate. That does not constitute an argument. It's sloppy. Ortiz is right: an organization has to run like an organism. He's just wrong to say it to Dan Shaughnessy who likes to cause explosions.

So Ben goes out and fills the clubhouse with "character guys."  Obviously, that character hasn't rubbed off on the players who were around in 2012.  It just goes to show what a classless and tasteless bunch this team is.  One, or all, of the big three in the front office need to tell the entire staff that V is technically still on the payroll and that trash talking your co-worker is not acceptable behavior.

Dan, the Red Sox are a 40-player roster, coaches, managers, and front office. You cite a few player's mildly negative comments about Bobby V and your article becomes the whole Red Sox blame it ALL on Valentine. Even the players who try to make positive comments about this year's manager, get credited by you as making negative comments about Bobby V. If a player says something good about Farrell, it doesn't have to mean he is blaming Bobby V for everything that went wrong. Even if a player says nothing, like Lester, he is credited with blaming Valentine. Your article overstates and overreaches to make its headline claim. The story is old in any case. Did Bobby V make some mistakes?- yes. Did the players collectively underperform even if some felt the manager made some mistakes?- yes. Was the front office slow to respond?- yes. This story is getting as tiresome as the fifth night of Thanksgiving turkey leftovers.  

You know, to a certain degree it may not even matter how much of it is really Valentine's fault and how much is just the players' perception of it being that way, at least for moving forward. It's entirely possible being able to place the blame on a big factor that's now been removed from the team environment will give the players the confidence that the biggest problem is gone, letting them brush off the past easier than otherwise. Even if he's just a scapegoat, it may be just what the team needs to break out of the mindset of dwelling on the collapse and the year that followed.

Yup, it's all bobby's fault. Didn't you know he was the one who made the Red Sox start with a 2-11 record in April 2011, then tank in late 2011, while eating chicken and drinking beer in the clubhouse. I heard Bobby even sprang for the chicken and beer so as not to bother Terry Francona, who seemed to be unaware what his players were doing at any time during a game, unless they were on the field. It was Bobby who s*cked so bad on the pitcher's mound and at bat in 2011 that they couldn't win a game for over a month.

Then Bobby fiendishly took over the reigns in 2012 to finish the job of destroying the Red Sox once and for all...mwahahahahaha!!!

Please. Valentine may not have been the best manager, but look what he had to work with - a sullen sorry bunch who took their frustrations for 2011 out on the manager hired to right the ship in 2012. They weren't going to listen to Bobby V no matter what he did. He was an interim manager - NO ONE was going to be able to work with that bunch. 

I hope for better this year. Bad wood is gone - Gonzo can work "God's will" from the dugout in LA (where the fans leave in the 6th inning), Carl Crawford can try to make excuses for the fact that he can't deal with the spotlight, and Josh Beckett can sulk all he wants to.

Farrell knows many of the guys. He was their pitching coach. he comes in with automatic credibility and the guys were going to listen to him from the get-go. I think, howeever, that he will NOT take guys drinking beer and eating chicken in the clubhouse when they should be on the bench. He's not going to take garbage from them. 

I hope the guys they brought in will be like Pedey and play their hearts out. And I hope Lackey finds his form and that the other pitchers get back to thinking of a "W" when they hit the mound. 

It's a game, boys. You get paid millions to play...a child's game. Enjoy it. You'll never have it so easy. HAVE FUN!

Shaughnessy strongly promoted the hiring of Valentine.  Its his fault

So, here's my problem with this article. The Sox have been washing their hands of Valentine ALL WINTER, so the timing of this "news bulletin" is frankly suspicious to me. Coming the day after Lucchino publicly dissed Shaughnessey in a press conference, this seems more like a vindictive self-serving rant.  As the saying goes, consider the source.